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Author Topic: NRA Petition to Fire Eric Holder  (Read 6481 times)

Offline GunLink

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NRA Petition to Fire Eric Holder
« on: July 12, 2011, 10:54:00 AM »
NRA Petition to Fire Eric Holder


Senator Charles Grassley"How did guns that were allowed to 'walk' out of gun shops during Operation Fast and Furious end up at a U.S Border Patrol agent's murder scene?"
Attorney General Eric Holder"I don't know"


That one statement from our nation's top law-enforcement official proves that Attorney General Holder is either covering up for Obama, his failed gun control schemes and the crimes committed, or he's incompetent.

Either way, he can't be trusted with the powers of Attorney General, the law enforcement agencies he commands, the sanctity of the Second Amendment, or the lives of Federal agents.

That's why NRA is launching a nationwide campaign to gather hundreds of thousands of signatures on this Petition to Fire Eric Holder, one of the chief architects of Obama's gun ban agenda.

And I'm turning to you to help lead this fight by signing NRA's petition today.



Sign the petition at https://www.nra.org/fireholder/

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NRA Petition to Fire Eric Holder
« on: July 12, 2011, 10:54:00 AM »

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Offline masfonos

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Re: NRA Petition to Fire Eric Holder
« Reply #1 on: July 12, 2011, 11:05:10 AM »
I'm not sure how much good it will do and it resulted in a typical NRA hat-in-hand spiel, but I signed it.


Quote
Thank You!

Dear Fellow American:

Thank you for signing NRA's National Petition to Fire Eric Holder.

Your participation in this vital project will help us remove one of the chief architects of Obama's gun control schemes, and blow the lid off the Operation Fast and Furious cover-up.

To help NRA fight this battle, I'm hoping you'll make a contribution of $20, $40, $60, $80, $100 or the most generous amount you can afford to NRA Voice of Freedom today.

With your support of NRA's Voice of Freedom, we'll tell the story that the anti-gun media refuses to tell. We will expose the deep, stinking rot of the Operation Fast and Furious conspiracy on T.V., radio and the Internet.

We will tell the truth on blogs, social networking sites and Facebook pages. We will work with America's gun and hunting magazines to get the story told.

We must act now because the Obama Administration and Holder have crossed the line.

They've used a government law-enforcement agency to advance their gun-ban agenda. They forced law-abiding gun dealers to commit crimes. These schemes endangered untold numbers of innocents and a U.S. Border Patrol Agent is dead.

Thank you for doing your part by signing NRA's petition and making your generous contribution to NRA's Voice of Freedom today. I look forward to hearing from you as soon as possible.

Yours in Liberty,
Wayne LaPierre
Executive Vice President

Offline Uncle Buck

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Re: NRA Petition to Fire Eric Holder
« Reply #2 on: July 12, 2011, 01:36:21 PM »
Signed it.

Maybe if they get enough signatures, the Chicago style political machine in charge will see they need to act and do something to make it look like they "Did Something."  I doubt it, but maybe.

Offline 1slickAR15

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Re: NRA Petition to Fire Eric Holder
« Reply #3 on: July 13, 2011, 09:05:20 AM »
"good riddance to bad rubbish!"

I "signed" it

Offline bdub

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Re: NRA Petition to Fire Eric Holder
« Reply #4 on: August 03, 2011, 12:24:56 PM »
Signed it.  Also sent my congressman an email requesting he provide his support in bringing Holder to justice.

Offline GunLink

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Re: NRA Petition to Fire Eric Holder
« Reply #5 on: November 10, 2011, 08:52:37 AM »
[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LvwkmM1vXpg[/youtube]




The Time Has Come to Fire Eric Holder--NRA launches ad campaign
Friday, November 04, 2011
NRA-ILA


The cauldron that is the “Fast and Furious” scandal continues to boil this week, with 35 members of Congress now calling for Attorney General Eric Holder’s immediate resignation.  Meanwhile, the White House and the Justice Department remain silent and stubbornly continue to ignore the demands to remove Holder.

It’s time to fire Eric Holder.  Crimes were committed in the name of advancing an anti-gun agenda, and the longer these crimes go unanswered--the longer Attorney General Eric Holder stonewalls Congress--the greater the threat to our freedom.

NRA-ILA has prepared a video that all freedom-loving Americans need to watch.  The video shows that Holder's actions prove he can't be trusted with the sanctity of our freedoms, the powers of his office, or the lives of our law enforcement officers.  To watch the video, please click here.

Please help spread the word and forward this video to family, friends and fellow gun owners.

Offline masfonos

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Re: NRA Petition to Fire Eric Holder
« Reply #6 on: November 10, 2011, 09:53:02 PM »
*sigh*

This clown is still around?  Too bad we can't take the vote early/vote often route here.

Offline small

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Re: NRA Petition to Fire Eric Holder
« Reply #7 on: November 12, 2011, 11:53:54 AM »
While this happened I for one would like to see ATF gone and all restrictive gun laws gone. If that was the case then these gun would have just just as easily made there way into criminals hands. Again that is my opinion.

The Last AG we had again IMO was far worse and the NRA I don't recall said anything.
this is great for a laugh as are many  of his appearances in front of congress and the senate.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7IBvZlRqOTw

Offline SharpsShooter

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Re: NRA Petition to Fire Eric Holder
« Reply #8 on: November 14, 2011, 10:37:36 AM »
I'm in.  I call that a step in the right direction ;D

Offline masfonos

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Re: NRA Petition to Fire Eric Holder
« Reply #9 on: November 14, 2011, 12:12:07 PM »
The Last AG we had again IMO was far worse and the NRA I don't recall said anything.
this is great for a laugh as are many  of his appearances in front of congress and the senate.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7IBvZlRqOTw


The NRA and other pro-2A groups did say something.  Gonzales was a dirty tool and the calls for his head led to his resignation not a second too soon, but "I don't recall" (:D) much of a reason for NRA or other pro-2A organizations to air ads or circulate petitions for his dismissal any more than they would for the myriad other anti-gun politicians.  Despite not actively pursuing his termination as they are with Holder, the NRA certainly didn't roll over and sit quietly for AG Gonzales.  With a few exceptions, most of what Gonzales did which caused people to not like him, was outside the realm of what pro-2A organizations would be concerned with.

The DOJ, under Gonzales' supervision, suggested adding persons suspected to be or to have been engaged in conduct constituting, preparation for, in aid of, or related to terrorism, or providing material support or resources for terrorism - regardless of whether charges or convictions for such exist to the list of people prevented by law from purchasing firearms.  The proposed legislation gave the AG discretionary authority to deny firearms transfers based on the above, as well as amending the process by which FFLs are issued and revoked.  JPFO published an article describing  this anti-2A legislation and circulated it to members.  They also later re-published a letter from a pro-freedom group which criticized the reintroduction of similar legislation.  The NRA, despite many false cries of "the NRA wants terrorists to have guns" in the press, released a widely circulated letter to Gonzales blasting the proposed legislation and claiming that it was in contravention to the US Consitution's second amendment.  The NRA stood behind it's claims, despite widespread criticism from the media, pro-gun control groups, politicians and others, saying "Right now law enforcement carefully monitors all firearms sales to those on the terror watch list.  Injecting the attorney general into the process just politicizes it."





Before that, in 2006 and 2007, with the DOJ still under Gonzales' supervision, the BATFE conducted another operation similar to 'Fast and Furious' called 'Wide Reciever'.  I believe the issue was sealed until recently (the end of 2010), so it's not much of a surprise that we didn't see outrage over the operation sooner.  So far, indictments from that case have led to charges against at least 9 people with at least 2 of them pleading guilty. 

In both cases, the main target of outrage ought to be the BATFE officials and agents in charge of conducting these operations and those involved in the politics of it (see the other thread here on the site where US Reps say that this is obviously a play at demonizing guns in order to enact stricter gun control laws).  As Sen. Grassley said, "whether it's Operation Fast and Furious, Operation Wide Receiver, or both, it's clear that guns were walked, and people high in the Justice Department knew about it. There's no excuse for walking guns, and if there are more operations like this, Congress and the American people need to know."

From what I gather, the main cause for the ire directed toward Holder isn't just from the fact that he was at the helm of the DOJ when it happened but rather because it appears that he may have known (based on emails and other correspondence) about the operation a LONG time ago and allowed it to continue as well as possibly lying to Congress about what he knew and when he knew it.  As far as I know (which isn't that far), there was never anything like that between Gonzales and Op Wide Receiver.  Who knows what would have turned up in an investigation during the time.  Unfortunately, it took something like Brian Terry to kick start this mess.

Offline small

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Re: NRA Petition to Fire Eric Holder
« Reply #10 on: November 15, 2011, 08:39:22 PM »
masfonos. I have been a NRA member for some time, 24 years or better. I don't think I didn't read a copy of American Riflemen  that they have sent me in that time. Although they are defender of the second amendment saying they "released a widely circulated letter to Gonzales blasting the proposed legislation and claiming that it was in contravention to the US Consitution's second amendment." I don't recall getting that memo unlike the others during different points in time. They also included a hand out for a little extra to help fight which at times I gave and other times didn't. The NRA also didn't ask him to step down but "blasted him". From what I have been reading, Holder although the head of the snake and covering for those who did wrong, wasn't at a point where he even compared to the Civil rights abuses from the former AG.

Offline masfonos

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Re: NRA Petition to Fire Eric Holder
« Reply #11 on: November 17, 2011, 08:31:45 PM »
I'm not sure why you wouldn't have gotten the memo.  They weren't exactly keeping it hush-hush with their calls to action each time this type of legislation came up.

Here, here, here and here are some of the memos.  Major media outlets got the memo.  FNC got it.  And CNN.    NY Daily News got it.  So did CBS.  Chicago Sun Times did too.  And Boston.com  The NY Times made it sound as if the NRA is directly putting weapons in the hands of AQ or cartels.  A house judiciary committee member from Chicago gave credit to the NRA when he said that the legislation's defeat "shows how extreme the National Rifle Association’s control over Congress really is."  I gather that he didn't mean it in a good way, either.  If you thought that that the main stream media made the NRA out to be the bad guy over this, the reaction from other pundits, bloggers, etc just goes downhill.  This article flat out claims that the NRA wants to arm terrorists.  This site calls the "NRA Scumbags" the "Enemies of America."  For more of the same, see articles and commentary here, here, here, here, here, here, here, here, here, here, here, here or at any number of other sources.


I don't mean to harp on this one issue, but you said that you didn't get this memo despite nearly everyone else getting it.  This is one of the few major black marks I can find against Gonzales as far as gun rights violations go.  Maybe you're right  that Holder didn't "even compare to the civil rights abuses from Gonzales" but the NRA isn't a general civil rights organization, it's a gun rights organization.  They're not going to go after someone for domestic wiretaps under the Patriot Act or most of the other stuff that the former AG pulled.  When Gonzales attempted to do what they saw as violating the second amendment, they attempted to put a stop to it and succeeded.  Multiple times.  When it comes out that Holder oversaw this F&F mess, which directly relates to guns, our gun rights and what even current US representatives say is an attempt to create a reason for stricter gun control, they attempt to put an end to it.

Why would we as A) gun rights proponents and B) people with common sense and a desire for civil rights not want Holder out of office?

Offline small

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Re: NRA Petition to Fire Eric Holder
« Reply #12 on: November 19, 2011, 08:52:47 PM »
Maybe I didn't type it as I wanted it read. In all your here, here, here, that I scrolled through NOT ONCE did it call on AG Gonzales to resign, or ask anyone to have him canned, no petitions for his removal. That was my point not that there was legislation that made the NRA out to be a bad guy. But writing a letter to Gonzales about pending legislation and asking NRA members and others to have the Current AG removed are simple two different things. I guess I didn't make that clear.

Is there anywhere else you can link that has the NRA asking for Gonzales to step down. That is the memo I did not get. It wasn't about any pending legislation but for his removal like is the theme for Holder currently.

Offline masfonos

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Re: NRA Petition to Fire Eric Holder
« Reply #13 on: November 20, 2011, 01:14:55 AM »
Quote
Maybe I didn't type it as I wanted it read. In all your here, here, here, that I scrolled through NOT ONCE did it call on AG Gonzales to resign, or ask anyone to have him canned, no petitions for his removal. That was my point not that there was legislation that made the NRA out to be a bad guy. But writing a letter to Gonzales about pending legislation and asking NRA members and others to have the Current AG removed are simple two different things. I guess I didn't make that clear.

Is there anywhere else you can link that has the NRA asking for Gonzales to step down. That is the memo I did not get. It wasn't about any pending legislation but for his removal like is the theme for Holder currently.

I guess what I'm typing may not be coming across as I intended for it to come across either.  The NRA didn't have the same reaction because the situations are not the same.  Yes, using lobbying clout and letter writing to stop anti-2A legislation is much different than calling for an Attorney General to be removed.  But keep in mind that trying to pass anti-2A legislation is also much different than allowing an organization that you oversee to execute an operation (against policy) which knowingly allows guns into the hands of terrorist organizations which are used against innocent civilians and USBP agents after you fail to keep track of them as planned.  At least I think they're on totally different levels.

When Gonzales tried to pass anti-2A legislation, NRA battled it with letters and lobbying.  When Holder tried to pass anti-2A legislation, NRA battled it with letters and lobbying.  Same reaction.

When Holder allows something like F&F where they let guns walk into the wrong side of a Mexican drug war with 43,000+ deaths so far (including thousands of police, military, politicans and civilians) and doesn't lift a finger to stop it, they call for his resignation.  It's a bit worse than signing an amicus brief in favor of a handgun ban. 



As I said before, there seems to be relatively few black marks against Gonzales as far as 2A violations go, and each of those were met in the same way that they are with any similar anti-2A action politician, Attorney General, et cetera, including Holder.  If someone knows of situations during Gonzales' reign that would cause the NRA to call for his resignation ("vote the bums out!" get-rid-of-anyone-who-is-the slightest-anti-2A mentality aside), please share them because I honestly don't know about them.

Offline 1slickAR15

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Re: NRA Petition to Fire Eric Holder
« Reply #14 on: November 20, 2011, 01:48:14 AM »
i think gonzales and holder were both pretty antigun.  I dont remember much about gonzales but I remember a few groups being against holder when he was coming in.

http://gunowners.org/a012009.htm
http://www.buckeyefirearms.org/node/6269

I agree the gunrunner thing looks a lot worse than the regular stuff that antigun politicians pull but the nra can't really (or won't) try to get them fired for doing that regular stuff.  It looks like this is just something that looks really bad that they can use as an excuse to get him out.  I wouldn't be sad to see any antigun politician out of office no matter what reason they use.

Offline small

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Re: NRA Petition to Fire Eric Holder
« Reply #15 on: November 20, 2011, 01:29:29 PM »
I guess when I am looking at it in totality, I see Holder anti-gun with a botched "Sting" which is used in Law enforcement all the time, which also happen to go wrong a lot of that time. I see the NRA ask for his ass out. I saw Gonzales and the previous Admin going after our civil rights on Many levels not just 2A and the NRA writes him a letter asking to work together (see pdf of the letter above). Two very different reactions.

My OP was that if no gun control were in place the same thing would/could have happened. I for one am for less, not more, gun laws. Asking Holder to step down brings to light the mess that happened. Yet someone in the media or anit-gun could easily pick up on that point I didn't make well. That w/o the laws the guys would have had the guns since even with laws they did. Time to be even more restrictive. I think this one need to quietly go away. 

Offline 1slickAR15

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Re: NRA Petition to Fire Eric Holder
« Reply #16 on: November 20, 2011, 02:56:03 PM »
I saw Gonzales and the previous Admin going after our civil rights on Many levels not just 2A and the NRA writes him a letter asking to work together (see pdf of the letter above). Two very different reactions.

Like masfonos says going after civil rights on many levels isn't something that the NRA deals with, the 2A stuff is what they deal with and they usually deal with it just like that by writing letters and playing the politics game.  As far as the "normal" anti 2A stuff goes the NRA looks like they went after both of them about the same.  This current thing is a lot bigger than the "normal" anti 2A stuff.  You are right about these laws obviously not stopping bad guys from getting guns.  I dont know why more people dont understand the idea that the laws only stop good guys that would follow the laws anyway.  On the other hand if they were enforcing the laws instead of letting the guns walk the laws would have stopped those thousands of guns from going to mexico.

Offline masfonos

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Re: NRA Petition to Fire Eric Holder
« Reply #17 on: November 20, 2011, 08:37:05 PM »
Holder doesn't just have a botched "sting that's used in law enforcement all the time."  He knowingly allowed guns to go to organizations responsible for tens of thousands of deaths over the past 5 years.  "Gun walking" is against Justice Department policy.  Holder himself says that it's against DOJ policy.  ATF agents and brass say that it's against their policy as well.  If Holder knew about this going on and let it continue, he sure as hell ought to be stripped of his AG title, at a minimum.

I'm not saying that Gonzales or any other politician doesn't trample civil rights every chance they get.  Calling for an AG to step down over wiretaps or other civil rights violations isn't the NRA's bailiwick.  I'm saying that Holder tramples gun rights every chance he gets AND ON TOP OF THAT now he's arming terrorists and murderers with an operation that a current US Congressmen says he can't think of any reason for other than for the administration to support an anti-firearm agenda.  Overseeing an organization that arms terrorists and murderers in order to push more restrictive gun laws is a pretty big deal.

If you wanted someone to call for Gonzales to step down for "going after our civil rights on Many levels not just 2A" then why aren't you angry at other civil rights organizations for not pushing such action?  Maybe I'm misunderstanding, but you seem to be complaining in numerous posts here about the NRA not going after Gonzales with the same zeal that they are going after Holder even when their actions aren't even in the same ballpark.

Offline small

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Re: NRA Petition to Fire Eric Holder
« Reply #18 on: November 26, 2011, 11:25:30 PM »
"US Congressmen says he can't think of any reason for other than for the administration to support an anti-firearm agenda." That is one mans opinion. I say that looking to take down a "network" that is smuggling guns south of the border "was" the objective. I'm not aware of other Anti-gun moves by AG Holder. I wouldn't say that it is even a 2A issue? Is there now a new proposal to Strengthen Gun Laws? Based on Fast and Furious? Again your, or the NRA, are making it sound like his intention was to have these guns actually be used to kill Americans. I'm going out on a limb to said I doubt that was the intent. Its like saying Dubya let September 11th happen.

The ACLU fought long and hard in New York to keep the Police from searching people at select subway stops. Saying that infringed on peoples personal right to privacy. These shakedowns took everyone on the platforms and had them frisked and bags searched, all in the name of fighting terror. A total waste of resources since to be "within" the law they had to give notice as people walked into the station. See the sign turn and walk away. Yet if that was your train and you needed to get to work you went and got searched.  Now I'm not a strong supporter of the ACLU for the simple fact that they feel (wrongly IMO) that 2A is a collective right and not individual so they don't fight 2A abuses.   

If you wanted someone to call for Gonzales to step down for "going after our civil rights on Many levels not just 2A" then why aren't you angry at other civil rights organizations for not pushing such action?  Maybe I'm misunderstanding, but you seem to be complaining in numerous posts here about the NRA not going after Gonzales with the same zeal that they are going after Holder even when their actions aren't even in the same ballpark.

I'm not certain how you'd know who I was angry with when AG Gonzales was in office?
I'm not certain there was any other post other then this thread made by me about the NRA? My point was that again in totality this doesn't rate, and I do not believe that Holders intent or those at the ATF were looking to have this FAIL and have Americans killed just to push a more restrictive gun control agenda. It not that it isn't possible but I don't see the conspiracy in this one. And I am one that see many conspiracies in our government. 

Again with all the post of here, here and here and also you said "The DOJ, under Gonzales' supervision, suggested adding persons suspected to be or to have been engaged in conduct constituting, preparation for, in aid of, or related to terrorism, or providing material support or resources for terrorism - regardless of whether charges or convictions for such exist to the list of people prevented by law from purchasing firearms. " This is a DIRECT attack on the 2A and the NRA asks to work with the AG (again you posted a link to the letter) here w/F&F  there is a "Conspiracy Theory" to attack the 2A and they ask for the AG to step down. Seems like to very different reactions to two very different actions. One was directly affecting the 2A (although trying to keep guns out of the hands of those plotting to kill Americans) and was softballed, the others is "potential" harmful and they go guns blazing. Do you not see the difference you say not even in the same ballpark? You're right there Gonzales was playing in the big leagues swinging for the fences and this Holder stuff isn't even AAA not even close. Yet the NRA reaction seems to be full blown world series game 7.
   





Offline GunLink

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Re: NRA Petition to Fire Eric Holder
« Reply #19 on: December 05, 2011, 09:49:29 AM »
Well, if it turns out that Holder did know about the operation much earlier than he lets on, as evidence suggests that he did, perhaps this shoe might fit him well.


Quote
hyp·o·crite
   /ˈhɪpəkrɪt/ [hip-uh-krit]
noun

1. a person who pretends to have virtues, moral or religious beliefs, principles, etc., that he or she does not actually possess, especially a person whose actions belie stated beliefs.
2. a person who feigns some desirable or publicly approved attitude, especially one whose private life, opinions, or statements belie his or her public statements.



Attorney General Eric Holder, right, and former ATF Director Kenneth Melson
at the ATF's 13th Annual Memorial Observance for agency officials killed in
line of duty, May 2009




US Attorney General: 'Fast and Furious' Effects to Linger
VOA News

U.S. Attorney General Eric Holder says the effects of a failed investigation into weapons-trafficking on the U.S.-Mexico border will be felt for years to come.

Holder spoke Tuesday before the Senate Judiciary Committee in a hearing on the so-called "Fast and Furious" operation meant to track guns bought in the United States and smuggled into Mexico.

Agents with the U.S. Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms and Explosives agency have told lawmakers they were ordered by their bosses to stand aside while gun buyers purchased weapons that were suspected to be destined for Mexican drug cartels. The agents said they were told not to arrest the buyers, but instead to track where the purchasers went.

Two of the guns later turned up at the scene of a shoot-out in Arizona that left a U.S. border patrol agent dead.

Holder said Tuesday that any incidence of so-called "gun walking" is unacceptable and must never happen again. He added that the scandal has highlighted the fact that the U.S. is losing the battle to stop the flow of illegal guns to Mexico.

The revelations have outraged some members of Congress, prompting calls for Holder's resignation.